Thus have I heard. On one occasion the Blessed One was wandering in the Kosalan country with a large Sangha of bhikkhus, and eventually he arrived at a Kosalan brahmin village named Sālā.
The brahmin householders of Sālā heard: “The recluse Gotama, the son of the Sakyans who went forth from a Sakyan clan, has been wandering in the Kosalan country with a large Sangha of bhikkhus and has come to Sālā. Now a good report of Master Gotama has been spread to this effect: ‘That Blessed One is accomplished, fully enlightened, perfect in true knowledge and conduct, sublime, knower of worlds, incomparable leader of persons to be tamed, teacher of gods and humans, enlightened, blessed. He declares this world with its gods, its Māras, and its Brahmās, this generation with its recluses and brahmins, its princes and its people, which he has himself realised with direct knowledge. He teaches the Dhamma good in the beginning, good in the middle, and good in the end, with the right meaning and phrasing, and he reveals a holy life that is utterly perfect and pure.’ Now it is good to see such arahants.”
Then the brahmin householders of Sālā went to the Blessed One. Some paid homage to the Blessed One and sat down at one side; some exchanged greetings with him, and when this courteous and amiable talk was finished, sat down at one side; some extended their hands in reverential salutation towards the Blessed One and sat down at one side; some pronounced their name and clan in the Blessed One’s presence and sat down at one side; some kept silent and sat down at one side.
When they were seated, the Blessed One asked them: “Householders, is there any teacher agreeable to you in whom you have acquired faith supported by reasons?”
“No, venerable sir, there is no teacher agreeable to us in whom we have acquired faith supported by reasons.”
“Since, householders, you have not found an agreeable teacher, you may undertake and practise this incontrovertible teaching; for when the incontrovertible teaching is accepted and undertaken, it will lead to your welfare and happiness for a long time. And what is the incontrovertible teaching?
i. The Doctrine of Nihilism
A “Householders, there are some recluses and brahmins whose doctrine and view is this: ‘There is nothing given, nothing offered, nothing sacrificed; no fruit or result of good and bad actions; no this world, no other world; no mother, no father; no beings who are reborn spontaneously; no good and virtuous recluses and brahmins in the world who have themselves realised by direct knowledge and declare this world and the other world.’
B “Now there are some recluses and brahmins whose doctrine is directly opposed to that of those recluses and brahmins, and they say thus: ‘There is what is given and what is offered and what is sacrificed; there is fruit and result of good and bad actions; there is this world and the other world; there is mother and father; there are beings who are reborn spontaneously; there are good and virtuous recluses and brahmins in the world who have themselves realised by direct knowledge and declare this world and the other world.’ What do you think, householders? Don’t these recluses and brahmins hold doctrines directly opposed to each other?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”
A.i “Now, householders, of those recluses and brahmins whose doctrine and view is this: ‘There is nothing given…no good and virtuous recluses and brahmins in the world who have themselves realised by direct knowledge and declare this world and the other world,’ it is to be expected that they will avoid these three wholesome states, namely, good bodily conduct, good verbal conduct, and good mental conduct, and that they will undertake and practise these three unwholesome states, namely, bodily misconduct, verbal misconduct, and mental misconduct. Why is that? Because those good recluses and brahmins do not see in unwholesome states the danger, degradation, and defilement, nor do they see in wholesome states the blessing of renunciation, the aspect of cleansing.
A.ii “Since there actually is another world, one who holds the view ‘there is no other world’ has wrong view. Since there actually is another world, one who intends ‘there is no other world’ has wrong intention. Since there actually is another world, one who makes the statement ‘there is no other world’ has wrong speech. Since there actually is another world, one who says ‘there is no other world’ is opposed to those arahants who know the other world. Since there actually is another world, one who convinces another ‘there is no other world’ convinces him to accept an untrue Dhamma; and because he convinces another to accept an untrue Dhamma, he praises himself and disparages others. Thus any pure virtue that he formerly had is abandoned and corrupt conduct is substituted. And this wrong view, wrong intention, wrong speech, opposition to noble ones, convincing another to accept an untrue Dhamma, and self-praise and disparagement of others—these several evil unwholesome states thus come into being with wrong view as their condition.
A.iii “About this a wise man considers thus: ‘If there is no other world, then on the dissolution of the body this good person will have made himself safe enough. But if there is another world, then on the dissolution of the body, after death, he will reappear in a state of deprivation, in an unhappy destination, in perdition, even in hell. Now whether or not the word of those good recluses and brahmins is true, let me assume that there is no other world: still this good person is here and now censured by the wise as an immoral person, one of wrong view who holds the doctrine of nihilism. But on the other hand, if there is another world, then this good person has made an unlucky throw on both counts: since he is censured by the wise here and now, and since on the dissolution of the body, after death, he will reappear in a state of deprivation, in an unhappy destination, in perdition, even in hell. He has wrongly accepted and undertaken this incontrovertible teaching in such a way that it extends only to one side and excludes the wholesome alternative.’
B.i “Now, householders, of those recluses and brahmins whose doctrine and view is this: ‘There is what is given…there are good and virtuous recluses and brahmins in the world who have themselves realised by direct knowledge and declare this world and the other world,’ it is to be expected that they will avoid these three unwholesome states, namely, bodily misconduct, verbal misconduct, and mental misconduct, and that they will undertake and practise these three wholesome states, namely, good bodily conduct, good verbal conduct, and good mental conduct. Why is that? Because those good recluses and brahmins see in unwholesome states the danger, degradation, and defilement, and they see in wholesome states the blessing of renunciation, the aspect of cleansing.
B.ii “Since there actually is another world, one who holds the view ‘there is another world’ has right view. Since there actually is another world, one who intends ‘there is another world’ has right intention. Since there actually is another world, one who makes the statement ‘there is another world’ has right speech. Since there actually is another world, one who says ‘there is another world’ is not opposed to those arahants who know the other world. Since there actually is another world, one who convinces another ‘there is another world’ convinces him to accept true Dhamma; and because he convinces another to accept true Dhamma, he does not praise himself and disparage others. Thus any corrupt conduct that he formerly had is abandoned and pure virtue is substituted. And this right view, right intention, right speech, non-opposition to noble ones, convincing another to accept true Dhamma, and avoidance of self-praise and disparagement of others—these several wholesome states thus come into being with right view as their condition.
B.iii “About this a wise man considers thus: ‘If there is another world, then on the dissolution of the body, after death, this good person will reappear in a happy destination, even in the heavenly world. Now whether or not the word of those good recluses and brahmins is true, let me assume that there is no other world: still this good person is here and now praised by the wise as a virtuous person, one with right view who holds the doctrine of affirmation. And on the other hand, if there is another world, then this good person has made a lucky throw on both counts: since he is praised by the wise here and now, and since on the dissolution of the body, after death, he will reappear in a happy destination, even in the heavenly world. He has rightly accepted and undertaken this incontrovertible teaching in such a way that it extends to both sides and excludes the unwholesome alternative.’
ii. The Doctrine of Non-Doing
A “Householders, there are some recluses and brahmins whose doctrine and view is this: ‘When one acts or makes others act, when one mutilates or makes others mutilate, when one tortures or makes others inflict torture, when one inflicts sorrow or makes others inflict sorrow, when one oppresses or makes others inflict oppression, when one intimidates or makes others inflict intimidation, when one kills living beings, takes what is not given, breaks into houses, plunders wealth, commits burglary, ambushes highways, seduces another’s wife, utters falsehood—no evil is done by the doer. If, with a razor-rimmed wheel, one were to make the living beings on this earth into one mass of flesh, into one heap of flesh, because of this there would be no evil and no outcome of evil. If one were to go along the south bank of the Ganges killing and slaughtering, mutilating and making others mutilate, torturing and making others inflict torture, because of this there would be no evil and no outcome of evil. If one were to go along the north bank of the Ganges giving gifts and making others give gifts, making offerings and making others make offerings, because of this there would be no merit and no outcome of merit. By giving, by taming oneself, by restraint, by speaking truth, there is no merit and no outcome of merit.’
B “Now there are some recluses and brahmins whose doctrine is directly opposed to that of those recluses and brahmins, and they say thus: ‘When one acts or makes others act, when one mutilates or makes others mutilate…utters falsehood—evil is done by the doer. If, with a razor-rimmed wheel, one were to make the living beings on this earth into one mass of flesh, into one heap of flesh, because of this there would be evil and the outcome of evil. If one were to go along the south bank of the Ganges killing and slaughtering, mutilating and making others mutilate, torturing and making others inflict torture, because of this there would be evil and the outcome of evil. If one were to go along the north bank of the Ganges giving gifts and making others give gifts, making offerings and making others make offerings, because of this there would be merit and the outcome of merit. By giving, by taming oneself, by restraint, by speaking truth, there is merit and the outcome of merit.’ What do you think, householders? Don’t these recluses and brahmins hold doctrines directly opposed to each other?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”
A.i “Now, householders, of those recluses and brahmins whose doctrine and view is this: ‘When one acts or makes others act…there is no merit and no outcome of merit,’ it is to be expected that they will avoid these three wholesome states, namely, good bodily conduct, good verbal conduct and good mental conduct, and that they will undertake and practise these three unwholesome states, namely, bodily misconduct, verbal misconduct, and mental misconduct. Why is that? Because those good recluses and brahmins do not see in unwholesome states the danger, degradation, and defilement, nor do they see in wholesome states the blessing of renunciation, the aspect of cleansing.
A.ii “Since there actually is doing, one who holds the view ‘there is no doing’ has wrong view. Since there actually is doing, one who intends ‘there is no doing’ has wrong intention. Since there actually is doing, one who makes the statement ‘there is no doing’ has wrong speech. Since there actually is doing, one who says ‘there is no doing’ is opposed to those arahants who hold the doctrine that there is doing. Since there actually is doing, one who convinces another ‘there is no doing’ convinces him to accept an untrue Dhamma; and because he convinces another to accept an untrue Dhamma, he praises himself and disparages others. Thus any pure virtue that he formerly had is abandoned and corrupt conduct is substituted. And this wrong view, wrong intention, wrong speech, opposition to noble ones, convincing another to accept an untrue Dhamma, and self-praise and disparagement of others—these several evil unwholesome states thus come into being with wrong view as their condition.
A.iii “About this a wise man considers thus: ‘If there is no doing, then on the dissolution of the body this good person will have made himself safe enough. But if there is doing, then on the dissolution of the body, after death, he will reappear in a state of deprivation, in an unhappy destination, in perdition, even in hell. Now whether or not the word of those good recluses and brahmins is true, let me assume that there is no doing: still this good person is here and now censured by the wise as an immoral person, one of wrong view who holds the doctrine of non-doing. But on the other hand, if there is doing, then this good person has made an unlucky throw on both counts: since he is censured by the wise here and now, and since on the dissolution of the body, after death, he will reappear in a state of deprivation, in an unhappy destination, in perdition, even in hell. He has wrongly accepted and undertaken this incontrovertible teaching in such a way that it extends only to one side and excludes the wholesome alternative.’
B.i “Now, householders, of those recluses and brahmins whose doctrine and view is this: ‘When one acts or makes others act…there is merit and outcome of merit,’ it is to be expected that they will avoid these three unwholesome states, namely, bodily misconduct, verbal misconduct, and mental misconduct, and that they will undertake and practise these three wholesome states, namely, good bodily conduct, good verbal conduct, and good mental conduct. Why is that? Because those good recluses and brahmins see in unwholesome states the danger, degradation, and defilement, and they see in wholesome states the blessing of renunciation, the aspect of cleansing.
B.ii “Since there actually is doing, one who holds the view ‘there is doing’ has right view. Since there actually is doing, one who intends ‘there is doing’ has right intention. Since there actually is doing, one who makes the statement ‘there is doing’ has right speech. Since there actually is doing, one who says ‘there is doing’ is not opposed to those arahants who hold the doctrine that there is doing. Since there actually is doing, one who convinces another ‘there is doing’ convinces him to accept true Dhamma; and because he convinces another to accept true Dhamma, he does not praise himself and disparage others. Thus any corrupt conduct that he formerly had is abandoned and pure virtue is substituted. And this right view, right intention, right speech, non-opposition to noble ones, convincing another to accept true Dhamma, and avoidance of self-praise and disparagement of others—these several wholesome states thus come into being with right view as their condition.
B.iii “About this a wise man considers thus: ‘If there is doing, then on the dissolution of the body, after death, this good person will reappear in a happy destination, even in the heavenly world. Now whether or not the word of those good recluses and brahmins is true, let me assume that there is no doing: still this good person is here and now praised by the wise as a virtuous person, one with right view who holds the doctrine of doing. And on the other hand, if there is doing, then this good person has made a lucky throw on both counts: since he is praised by the wise here and now, and since on the dissolution of the body, after death, he will reappear in a happy destination, even in the heavenly world. He has rightly accepted and undertaken this incontrovertible teaching in such a way that it extends to both sides and excludes the unwholesome alternative.’
iii. The Doctrine of Non-Causality
A “Householders, there are some recluses and brahmins whose doctrine and view is this: ‘There is no cause or condition for the defilement of beings; beings are defiled without cause or condition. There is no cause or condition for the purification of beings; beings are purified without cause or condition. There is no power, no energy, no manly strength, no manly endurance. All beings, all living things, all creatures, all souls are without mastery, power, and energy; moulded by destiny, circumstance, and nature, they experience pleasure and pain in the six classes.’
B “Now there are some recluses and brahmins whose doctrine is directly opposed to that of those recluses and brahmins, and they say thus: ‘There is a cause and condition for the defilement of beings; beings are defiled owing to a cause and condition. There is a cause and condition for the purification of beings; beings are purified owing to a cause and condition. There is power, energy, manly strength, manly endurance. It is not the case that all beings, all living things, all creatures, all souls are without mastery, power, and energy, or that moulded by destiny, circumstance, and nature, they experience pleasure and pain in the six classes.’ What do you think, householders? Don’t these recluses and brahmins hold doctrines directly opposed to each other?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”
A.i “Now, householders, of those recluses and brahmins whose doctrine and view is this: ‘There is no cause or condition for the defilement of beings…they experience pleasure and pain in the six classes,’ it is to be expected that they will avoid these three wholesome states, namely, good bodily conduct, good verbal conduct, and good mental conduct, and that they will undertake and practise these three unwholesome states, namely, bodily misconduct, verbal misconduct, and mental misconduct. Why is that? Because those good recluses and brahmins do not see in unwholesome states the danger, degradation, and defilement, nor do they see in wholesome states the blessing of renunciation, the aspect of cleansing.
A.ii “Since there actually is causality, one who holds the view ‘there is no causality’ has wrong view. Since there actually is causality, one who intends ‘there is no causality’ has wrong intention. Since there actually is causality, one who makes the statement ‘there is no causality’ has wrong speech. Since there actually is causality, one who says ‘there is no causality’ is opposed to those arahants who hold the doctrine of causality. Since there actually is causality, one who convinces another ‘there is no causality’ convinces him to accept an untrue Dhamma; and because he convinces another to accept an untrue Dhamma, he praises himself and disparages others. Thus any pure virtue that he formerly had is abandoned and corrupt conduct is substituted. And this wrong view, wrong intention, wrong speech, opposition to noble ones, convincing another to accept an untrue Dhamma, and self-praise and disparagement of others—these several evil unwholesome states thus come into being with wrong view as their condition.
A.iii “About this a wise man considers thus: ‘If there is no causality, then on the dissolution of the body this good person will have made himself safe enough. But if there is causality, then on the dissolution of the body, after death, he will reappear in a state of deprivation, in an unhappy destination, in perdition, even in hell. Now whether or not the word of those good recluses and brahmins is true, let me assume that there is no causality: still this good person is here and now censured by the wise as an immoral person, one of wrong view who holds the doctrine of non-causality. But on the other hand, if there is causality, then this good person has made an unlucky throw on both counts: since he is censured by the wise here and now, and since on the dissolution of the body, after death, he will reappear in a state of deprivation, in an unhappy destination, in perdition, even in hell. He has wrongly accepted and undertaken this incontrovertible teaching in such a way that it extends only to one side and excludes the wholesome alternative.’
B.i “Now, householders, of those recluses and brahmins whose doctrine and view is this: ‘There is a cause and condition for the defilement of beings…they experience pleasure and pain in the six classes,’ it is to be expected that they will avoid these three unwholesome states, namely, bodily misconduct, verbal misconduct, and mental misconduct, and that they will undertake and practise these three wholesome states, namely, good bodily conduct, good verbal conduct, and good mental conduct. Why is that? Because those good recluses and brahmins see in unwholesome states the danger, degradation, and defilement, and they see in wholesome states the blessing of renunciation, the aspect of cleansing.
B.ii “Since there actually is causality, one who holds the view ‘there is causality’ has right view. Since there actually is causality, one who intends ‘there is causality’ has right intention. Since there actually is causality, one who makes the statement ‘there is causality’ has right speech. Since there actually is causality, one who says ‘there is causality’ is not opposed to those arahants who hold the doctrine of causality. Since there actually is causality, one who convinces another ‘there is causality’ convinces him to accept true Dhamma; and because is he convinces another to accept true Dhamma, he does not praise himself and disparage others. Thus any corrupt conduct that he formerly had is abandoned and pure virtue is substituted. And this right view, right intention, right speech, non-opposition to noble ones, convincing another to accept true Dhamma, and avoidance of self-praise and disparagement of others—these several wholesome states thus come into being with right view as their condition.
B.iii “About this a wise man considers thus: ‘If there is causality, then on the dissolution of the body, after death, this good person will reappear in a happy destination, even in the heavenly world. Now whether or not the word of those good recluses and brahmins is true, let me assume that there is no causality: still this good person is here and now praised by the wise as a virtuous person, one with right view who holds the doctrine of causality. And on the other hand, if there is causality, then this good person has made a lucky throw on both counts: since he is praised by the wise here and now, and since on the dissolution of the body, after death, he will reappear in a happy destination, even in the heavenly world. He has rightly accepted and undertaken this incontrovertible teaching in such a way that it extends to both sides and excludes the unwholesome alternative.’
iv. There Are no Immaterial Realms
“Householders, there are some recluses and brahmins whose doctrine and view is this: ‘There are definitely no immaterial realms.’
“Now there are some recluses and brahmins whose doctrine is directly opposed to that of those recluses and brahmins, and they say thus: ‘There definitely are immaterial realms.’ What do you think, householders? Don’t these recluses and brahmins hold doctrines directly opposed to each other?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”
“About this a wise man considers thus: ‘These good recluses and brahmins hold the doctrine and view “there are definitely no immaterial realms,” but that has not been seen by me. And these other good recluses and brahmins hold the doctrine and view “there definitely are immaterial realms,” but that has not been known by me. If, without knowing and seeing, I were to take one side and declare: “Only this is true, anything else is wrong,” that would not be fitting for me. Now as to the recluses and brahmins who hold the doctrine and view “there definitely are no immaterial realms,” if their word is true then it is certainly still possible that I might reappear after death among the gods of the fine-material realms who consist of mind. But as to the recluses and brahmins who hold the doctrine and view “there definitely are immaterial realms,” if their word is true then it is certainly possible that I might reappear after death among the gods of the immaterial realms who consist of perception. The taking up of rods and weapons, quarrels, brawls, disputes, recrimination, malice, and false speech are seen to occur based on material form, but this does not exist at all in the immaterial realms.’ After reflecting thus, he practises the way to disenchantment with material forms, to the fading away and cessation of material forms.
V. There is no Cessation of Being
“Householders, there are some recluses and brahmins whose doctrine and view is this: ‘There is definitely no cessation of being.’
“Now there are some recluses and brahmins whose doctrine is directly opposed to that of those recluses and brahmins, and they say thus: ‘There definitely is a cessation of being.’ What do you think, householders? Don’t these recluses and brahmins hold doctrines directly opposed to each other?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”
“About this a wise man considers thus: ‘These good recluses and brahmins hold the doctrine and view “there is definitely no cessation of being,” but that has not been seen by me. And these other good recluses and brahmins hold the doctrine and view “there definitely is a cessation of being,” but that has not been known by me. If, without knowing and seeing, I were to take one side and declare: “Only this is true, anything else is wrong,” that would not be fitting for me. Now as to the recluses and brahmins who hold the doctrine and view “there definitely is no cessation of being,” if their word is true then it is certainly still possible that I might reappear after death among the gods of the immaterial realms who consist of perception. But as to the recluses and brahmins who hold the doctrine and view “there definitely is a cessation of being,” if their word is true then it is possible that I might here and now attain final Nibbāna. The view of those good recluses and brahmins who hold the doctrine and view “there definitely is no cessation of being” is close to lust, close to bondage, close to delighting, close to holding, close to clinging; but the view of those good recluses and brahmins who hold the doctrine and view “there definitely is cessation of being” is close to non-lust, close to non-bondage, close to non-delighting, close to non-holding, close to non-clinging.’ After reflecting thus, he practises the way to disenchantment with being, to the fading away and cessation of being.
Four Kinds of Persons
“Householders, there are four kinds of persons to be found existing in the world. What four? Here a certain kind of person torments himself and pursues the practice of torturing himself. Here a certain kind of person torments others and pursues the practice of torturing others. Here a certain kind of person torments himself and pursues the practice of torturing himself, and he also torments others and pursues the practice of torturing others. Here a certain kind of person does not torment himself or pursue the practice of torturing himself, and he does not torment others or pursue the practice of torturing others. Since he torments neither himself nor others, he is here and now hungerless, extinguished, and cooled, and he abides experiencing bliss, having himself become holy.
“What kind of person, householders, torments himself and pursues the practice of torturing himself? Here a certain person goes naked, rejecting conventions…as Sutta 51, §8…Thus in such a variety of ways he dwells pursuing the practice of tormenting and mortifying the body. This is called the kind of person who torments himself and pursues the practice of torturing himself.
“What kind of person, householders, torments others and pursues the practice of torturing others? Here a certain person is a butcher of sheep…as Sutta 51, §9…or one who follows any other such bloody occupation. This is called the kind of person who torments others and pursues the practice of torturing others.
“What kind of a person, householders, torments himself and pursues the practice of torturing himself and also torments others and pursues the practice of torturing others? Here some person is a head-anointed noble king or a well-to-do brahmin… as Sutta 51, §10…And then his slaves, messengers, and servants make preparations, weeping with tearful faces, being spurred on by threats of punishment and by fear. This is called the kind of person who torments himself and pursues the practice of torturing himself and who torments others and pursues the practice of torturing others.
“What kind of person, householders, does not torment himself or pursue the practice of torturing himself and does not torment others or pursue the practice of torturing others—the one who, since he torments neither himself nor others, is here and now hungerless, extinguished, and cooled, and abides experiencing bliss, having himself become holy?
“Here, householders, a Tathāgata appears in the world…as Sutta 51, §§12-27 …He understands: ‘Birth is destroyed, the holy life has been lived, what had to be done has been done, there is no more coming to any state of being.’
“This, householders, is called the kind of person who does not torment himself or pursue the practice of torturing himself and who does not torment others or pursue the practice of torturing others—the one who, since he torments neither himself nor others, is here and now hungerless, extinguished, and cooled, and abides experiencing bliss, having himself become holy.”
When this was said, the brahmin householders of Sālā said to the Blessed One: “Magnificent, Master Gotama! Magnificent, Master Gotama! Master Gotama has made the Dhamma clear in many ways, as though he were turning upright what had been overthrown, revealing what was hidden, showing the way to one who was lost, or holding up a lamp in the darkness for those with eyesight to see forms. We go to Master Gotama for refuge and to the Dhamma and to the Sangha of bhikkhus. From today let Master Gotama accept us as lay followers who have gone to him for refuge for life.”
Setting
Thus have I heard: at one time the Lord, walking on tour among the Kosalans together with a large Order of monks, arrived at the Brahman village of the Kosalans named Sālā. The Brahman householders of Sālā heard: “It is said that the recluse Gotama, the son of the Sakyans, gone forth from the Sakyan family, and walking on tour among the Kosalans, together with a large Order of monks, has reached Sālā, and that a lovely reputation has gone forth about the Lord Gotama thus: ‘The Lord is perfected, wholly Self-awakened, endowed with (right) knowledge and conduct, well-farer, knower of the worlds, incomparable charioteer of men to be tamed, teacher of devas and men, the Awakened One, the Lord. He makes known this world with the devas, with Māra, with Brahmā, creation with its recluses and Brahmans, its devas and men, having realised them by his own super-knowledge. He teaches Dhamma that is lovely at the beginning, lovely in the middle, lovely at the ending, with the spirit and the letter; he proclaims the Brahmā-faring wholly fulfilled, quite purified. It were good to see perfected ones like this.’”
Then the Brahman householders of Sālā approached the Lord; some, having approached, having greeted the Lord, sat down at a respectful distance; some exchanged greetings with the Lord and having conversed in a friendly and courteous way, sat down at a respectful distance; some, having saluted the Lord with joined palms, sat down at a respectful distance; some, having made known their names and clans in the Lord's presence, sat down at a respectful distance; some, becoming silent, sat down at a respectful distance. As they were sitting down at a respectful distance, the Lord spoke thus to the Brahman householders of Sālā: “Have you, householders, some satisfactory teacher in whom your faith is grounded?” “We have no satisfactory teacher, revered sir, in whom our faith is grounded.” “If you, householders, have no satisfactory teacher, then taking up this sure Dhamma you should practise it. For, householders, sure is Dhamma; rightly undertaken, it will long be for your welfare and happiness. And what, householders, is this sure Dhamma?
Without Results
There are, householders, some recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of these views: ‘There is no (result of) gift, there is no (result of) offering, no (result of) sacrifice; there is no fruit or ripening of deeds well done or ill done; there is not this world, there is not a world beyond; there is no (benefit from serving) mother or father; there are no spontaneously arising beings; there are not in the world recluses and Brahmans who are faring rightly, proceeding rightly, and who proclaim this world and a world beyond, having realised them by their own super-knowledge.’ But, householders, there are some recluses and Brahmans who speak in direct opposition to these recluses and Brahmans, and who say this: ‘There is (result of) gift, there is (result of) offering, there is (result of) sacrifice; there is fruit and ripening of deeds well done and ill done; there is this world, there is a world beyond; there is (benefit from serving) mother and father; there are spontaneously uprising beings; there are in the world recluses and Brahmans who are faring rightly, proceeding rightly, and who proclaim this world and a world beyond, having realised them by their own super-knowledge.’
What do you think about this, householders? Do not these recluses and Brahmans speak in direct opposition to one another?” “Yes, revered sir.”
“As to this, householders, of those recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of these views: ‘There is no (result of) gift… having realised them by their own super-knowledge,’ this is to be expected for them: Having laid aside these three good things: right conduct of body, right conduct of speech, right conduct of thought, and taking up these three bad things: wrong conduct of body, wrong conduct of speech, wrong conduct of thought, they practise them.
What is the reason for this? It is that these worthy recluses and Brahmans do not see the peril in wrong things, the vanity, the defilement, nor the advantage, allied to purity, of renouncing them for the good things. And because there is indeed a world beyond, the view of anyone that there is not a world beyond is a false view of his. As there is indeed a world beyond, if anyone has the conception that there is not a world beyond, it is a false conception of his. As there is indeed a world beyond, if anyone utters the speech: ‘There is not a world beyond,’ it is a false speech of his. As there is indeed a world beyond, if anyone says that there is not a world beyond, he makes mock of those perfected ones who are knowers of a world beyond. As there is indeed a world beyond, if he convinces others that there is not a world beyond, that convincing of his is against true Dhamma, and because of that convincing, which is against true Dhamma, he is exalting himself and disparaging others.
Indeed, before his good morality is got rid of, bad morality is set up. And this false view, false conception, false speech, the mocking of the ariyans, the convincing which is against true Dhamma, the exalting of oneself, the disparaging of others—these are a variety of evil, unskilled states that arise thus because of false view.
Hereupon, householders, an intelligent man reflects thus: ‘If there is not a world beyond, this worthy individual at the breaking up of the body will make himself safe; but if there is a world beyond, this worthy individual at the breaking up of the body after dying, will arise in a sorrowful way, a bad bourn, the downfall, Niraya Hell. But if it be granted that there is not a world beyond, if this is a true speech of these recluses and Brahmans, then the worthy individual is condemned here and now by intelligent persons who say: ‘Of bad moral habit is the individual, of false view, he holds the theory of “There is not”.’ But if there is indeed a world beyond, thus is there defeat in two ways for this worthy individual: inasmuch as he is condemned here and now by intelligent persons, and inasmuch as at the breaking up of the body after dying he will uprise in a sorrowful way, a bad bourn, the downfall, Niraya Hell. Thus this sure Dhamma has been undertaken imperfectly by him, he has applied himself one-sidedly, he is neglecting the skilled stance.
With Results
Hereupon, householders, of those recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of these views: ‘There is (result of) gift,… having realised them by their own super-knowledge,’ this is to be expected of them: Having laid aside these three bad things: wrong conduct of body, wrong conduct of speech, wrong conduct of thought, and taking up these three good things: right conduct of body, right conduct of speech, right conduct of thought, they practise them.
What is the reason for this? It is that these worthy recluses and Brahmans see the peril, the vanity, the defilement in wrong things, and the advantage, allied to purity, of renouncing them for states that are good. And because there is indeed a world beyond, the view of anyone that there is a world beyond is a right view of his. As there is indeed a world beyond, if anyone has the conception that there is a world beyond it is a right conception of his. As there is indeed a world beyond, if anyone utters the speech: ‘There is a world beyond,’ it is a right speech of his. As there is indeed a world beyond, if anyone says that there is a world beyond, he does not make mock of those perfected ones who are knowers of the world beyond. As there is indeed a world beyond, if he convinces others that there is a world beyond, that convincing of his is according to true Dhamma, and because of this convincing which is in accordance with true Dhamma, he does not exalt just himself, he does not disparage others.
Indeed, before his bad morality is got rid of, good morality is set up. And this right view, right conception, right speech, this non-mocking of the ariyans, the convincing which is in accordance with true Dhamma, the non-exalting of self, the non-disparaging of others— these are a variety of good states that arise because of right view.
Hereupon, householders, an intelligent man reflects thus: ‘If there is a world beyond, this worthy individual at the breaking up of the body after dying will arise in a good bourn, a heaven world. But if it be granted that there is not a world beyond, if this is a true speech of these recluses and Brahmans, then this worthy individual is praised here and now by intelligent persons who say: ‘Of good moral habit is the individual, of right view, he holds the theory of “There is.” But if there is indeed a world beyond, thus is there victory in two ways for this worthy individual: inasmuch as he is praised here and now by intelligent persons, and inasmuch as at the breaking up of the body after dying he will uprise in a good bourn, a heaven world. Thus this sure Dhamma has been undertaken perfectly by him, he has applied himself two-sidedly, he is neglecting the unskilled stance.
There is no Evil
There are, householders, some recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of these views: ‘From doing, from making (another) do, from mutilating, from making (another) mutilate, from threatening, from making (another) threaten, from causing grief, from tormenting, from torturing, from making (another) torture, from making onslaught on creatures, from taking what is not given, from house-breaking, from plundering, from robbery, from waiting in ambush, from going after other men's wives, from lying speech—from acting (thus) evil is not done. If anyone with a discus having an edge sharp as a razor, should make the creatures of this earth into one mass of flesh, into one heap of flesh, from that source there is not evil, there is not the perpetuating of evil. And if anyone should go to the south bank of the Ganges slaying and striking, mutilating, making (others) mutilate, threatening, making (others) threaten, from that source there is not evil, there is not the perpetuating of evil. And if he should go to the north bank of the Ganges giving, making (others) give, offering, making (others) offer, from that source there is not merit, there is not the perpetuating of merit. There is no merit from giving, from taming oneself, from restraining oneself, from truth-speaking, there is not the perpetuating of merit.’
There is Evil
Householders, some recluses and Brahmans speak in direct opposition to these recluses and Brahmans, they speak thus: ‘From doing, from making (another) do… from lying… from acting (thus) evil is done. If anyone with a discus having an edge sharp as a razor should make the creatures of this earth into one heap of flesh, one mass of flesh, from that source there is evil, there is the perpetuating of evil. And if anyone should go to the south bank of the Ganges slaying and striking… from that source there is evil, there is the perpetuating of evil. And if he should go to the north bank of the Ganges giving, making (others) give… from that source there is merit, there is the perpetuating of merit. There is merit from giving, from taming oneself, from restraining oneself, from truth-speaking, there is the perpetuating of merit.’
What do you think about this, householders? Do not these recluses and Brahmans speak in direct opposition to one another?” “Yes, revered sir.”
“Hereupon, householders, of those recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and hold these views: ‘From doing, from making (another) do… there is not the perpetuating of merit,’ this is to be expected for them: Having laid aside these three good things: right conduct of body, right conduct of speech, right conduct of thought, and taking up these three bad things: wrong conduct of body, wrong conduct of speech, wrong conduct of thought, they practise them.
What is the reason for this? It is that these worthy recluses and Brahmans do not see the peril in wrong things, the vanity, the defilement, nor the advantage, allied to purity, of renouncing them for the good things. And because there is indeed effective action, the view of anyone that there is not effective action is a false view of his. As there is indeed effective action, if anyone has the conception that here is not effective action it is a false conception of his. As there is indeed effective action, if anyone utters the speech: ‘There is not effective action,’ it is a false speech of his. As there is indeed effective action, if anyone says there is not effective action he is making a mock of those perfected ones who profess effective action. As there is indeed effective action, if he convinces others that there is not effective action, that convincing of his is against true Dhamma, and because of that convincing which is against true Dhamma, he is exalting himself and disparaging others.
Indeed, before his good morality is got rid of, bad morality is set up. And this false view, false conception, false speech, the mocking of the ariyans, the convincing which is against true Dhamma, the exalting of oneself, the disparaging of others—these are a variety of evil, wrong states that arise because of false view.
Hereupon, householders, an intelligent man reflects thus: ‘If there is not effective action, this worthy individual at the breaking up of the body will make himself safe; but if there is effective action, this worthy individual at the breaking up of the body after dying will arise in a sorrowful way, a bad bourn, the downfall, Niraya Hell. But if it be granted that there is not effective action, if this is a true speech of these worthy recluses and Brahmans, then the worthy individual is condemned here and now by intelligent persons who say: “Of bad moral habit is the individual, of false view, he professes ineffective action.” But if there is indeed effective action, there is thus defeat in two ways for this worthy individual: inasmuch as he is condemned here and now by intelligent persons, and inasmuch as at the breaking up of the body after dying he will uprise in a sorrowful way, a bad bourn, the downfall, Niraya Hell. This sure Dhamma has thus been undertaken imperfectly by him, he has applied himself one-sidedly, he is neglecting the skilled stance.
Hereupon, householders, those recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and hold these views: ‘From doing, from making (another) do… there is the perpetuation of merit,’ this is to be expected for them: Having laid aside these three bad things: wrong conduct of body, wrong conduct of speech, wrong conduct of thought, and taking up these three good things: right conduct of body, right conduct of speech, right conduct of thought, they practise them.
What is the reason for this? It is that these worthy recluses and Brahmans see the peril in wrong things, the vanity, the defilement, and the advantage, allied to purity, of renouncing them for states that are good. And because there is indeed effective action, the view of anyone that there is effective action is a right view of his. And as there is indeed effective action, if anyone has the conception that there is effective action, it is a right conception of his. And as there is indeed effective action, if anyone utters the speech: ‘There is effective action,’ it is a right speech of his. And as there is indeed effective action, if anyone says that there is effective action, he is not making a mock of those perfected ones who hold the theory of effective action. As there is indeed effective action, if he convinces others that there is effective action, that convincing of his is according to true Dhamma, and because of this convincing which is in accordance with true Dhamma, he is not exalting himself, he is not disparaging others. Indeed before his bad morality is got rid of, good morality is set up. And this right view, right conception, right speech, the non-mocking of the ariyans, the convincing which is in accordance with true Dhamma, the non-exalting of self, the non-disparagement of others—these are a variety of good states which arise because of right view.
Hereupon, householders, an intelligent man reflects thus: ‘If there is effective action, this worthy individual at the breaking up of the body after dying will arise in a good bourn, a heaven world. But if it be granted that there is not effective action, if this is a true speech of these worthy recluses and Brahmans, then this worthy individual is raised here and now by intelligent persons who say: ‘Of good moral habit is the individual, of right view, he professes effective action. If there is indeed effective action, thus is there victory in two ways for this worthy individual: inasmuch as he is praised here and now by intelligent persons, and inasmuch as at the breaking up of the body after dying he will uprise in a good bourn, in a heaven world. Thus this sure Dhamma has been undertaken perfectly by him, he has applied himself two-sidedly, he is neglecting the unskilled stance.
With and Without Cause for Defilement or Purification
There are, householders, some recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of these views: ‘There is no cause, no reason for the defilement of creatures, creatures are defiled without cause, without reason. There is no cause, no reason for the purification of creatures, creatures are purified without cause, without reason. There is not strength, there is not energy, there is not human vigour, there is not human effort; all creatures, all breathing things, all beings, all living things are without power, without strength, without energy, bent by fate, chance, and nature, they experience pleasure and pain amid the six classes.’ But, householders, there are some recluses and Brahmans who speak in direct opposition to these recluses and Brahmans, and who say this: ‘There is cause, there is reason for the defilement of creatures, creatures are defiled with cause, with reason. There is cause, there is reason for the purification of creatures, creatures are purified with cause, with reason. There is strength, there is energy, there is human vigour, there is human effort; all creatures, all breathing things, all beings, all living things are not (so) without power, without strength, without energy that they are bent by fate, chance and nature, that they experience pleasure and pain amid the six classes.
What do you think about this, householders? Do not these recluses and Brahmans speak in direct opposition to one another?” “Yes, revered sir.”
“Hereupon, householders, those recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of these views: ‘There is no cause, there is no reason… amid the six classes,’ this is to be expected for them: Having laid aside the three good things: right conduct of body, right conduct of speech, right conduct of thought, and taking up these three bad things: wrong conduct of body, wrong conduct of speech, wrong conduct of thought, they practise them.
What is the reason for this? It is that these worthy recluses and Brahmans do not see the peril in wrong things, the vanity, the defilement, nor the advantage, allied to purity, in renouncing them for the good things. And because there is indeed cause, the view of anyone that there is not cause is a false view of his. As there is indeed cause, if anyone has the conception that there is not cause it is a false conception of his. As there is indeed cause, if anyone utters the speech: ‘There is not cause,’ it is a false speech of his. As there is indeed cause, if anyone says there is not cause, he makes mock of those perfected ones who profess that there is cause. As there is indeed cause, if he convinces others that there is not cause, this convincing of his is against true Dhamma, and because of this convincing which is against true Dhamma, he is exalting himself and disparaging others.
Indeed, before his good morality is got rid of, bad morality is set up. And this false view, false conception, false speech, the mocking of the ariyans, the convincing which is against true Dhamma, the exalting of oneself, the disparaging of others—these are a variety of evil, wrong states that arise thus because of false view.
Hereupon, householders, an intelligent man reflects thus: ‘If there is not cause, this worthy individual at the breaking up of the body will make himself safe; but if there is cause, this worthy individual at the breaking up of the body after dying will arise in a sorrowful way, a bad bourn, the downfall, Niraya Hell. But if it be granted that there is not cause, if this is a true speech of these recluses and Brahmans, then this worthy individual is condemned here and now by intelligent persons who say: “Of bad moral habit is the individual, of false view, he professes that there is not cause.” But if there is indeed cause, thus there is defeat in two ways for this worthy individual: inasmuch as he is condemned here and now by intelligent persons, and inasmuch as on the breaking up of the body after dying he will arise in a sorrowful way, a bad bourn, the downfall, Niraya Hell. This sure Dhamma has thus been imperfectly undertaken by him, he has applied himself one-sidedly, he is neglecting the skilled stance.
Hereupon, householders, those recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of these views: ‘There is cause, there is reason… amid the six classes,’ this is to be expected for them: Having laid aside these three bad things: wrong conduct of body, wrong conduct of speech, wrong conduct of thought, and taking up these three good things: right conduct of body, right conduct of speech, right conduct of thought, they practise them.
What is the reason for this? It is that these worthy recluses and Brahmans see the peril in wrong things, the vanity, the defilement, the advantage, allied to purity, of renouncing them for good states. And because there is indeed cause, the view of anyone that there is cause is a right view of his. As there is indeed cause, if anyone has the conception that there is cause it is a right conception of his. As there is indeed cause, if anyone utters the speech: ‘There is cause,’ it is a right speech of his. As there is indeed cause, if anyone says that there is cause, he does not make mock of those perfected ones who hold the theory of cause. As there is indeed cause, if he convinces others that there is cause, this convincing of his is in accordance with true Dhamma, and because of this convincing which is in accordance with true Dhamma, he does not exalt himself, does not disparage others.
Indeed, before his bad morality is got rid of, good morality is set up. And this right view, right conception, right speech, the non-mocking of the ariyans, the convincing which is in accordance with true Dhamma, the non-exalting of self, the non-disparaging of others—these are a variety of good states that arise because of right view.
Hereupon, householders, an intelligent man reflects thus: ‘If there is indeed cause, this worthy individual at the breaking up of the body after dying will arise in a good bourn, a heaven world. But if it be granted that there is not cause, if this is a true speech of these worthy recluses and Brahmans, then this worthy individual is praised here and now by intelligent persons who say: ‘Of good moral habit is the individual, of right view, he professes that there is cause.’ If there is indeed cause, thus is there victory in two ways for this worthy individual: inasmuch as he is praised here and now by intelligent persons, and inasmuch as on the breaking up of the body after dying he will arise in a good bourn, a heaven world. Thus this sure Dhamma has been undertaken perfectly by him, he has applied himself two-sidedly, he is neglecting the unskilled stance.
With and Without Formlessness
There are, householders, some recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of this view: ‘There is not formlessness throughout.’ But, householders, there are some recluses and Brahmans who are in direct opposition to these recluses and Brahmans, and who say this: ‘There is formlessness throughout.’
What do you think about this, householders? Do not these recluses and Brahmans speak in direct opposition to one another?” “Yes, revered sir.”
“Hereupon, householders, an intelligent man reflects thus: ‘Those worthy recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of this view: “There is not formlessness throughout”—this is not seen by me. And those worthy recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of this view: “There is formlessness throughout”—this is not known by me. And if I, not knowing, not seeing, were to take up one side and define it, saying: “This is the truth, all else is falsehood,” this would not be suitable in me.
If this is a true saying of these worthy recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of this view: “There is not formlessness throughout,” then this situation occurs that surely my uprising will be there where are those devas that have form and are made by mind. But if this is a true saying of those worthy recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of this view: “There is formlessness throughout,” then this situation occurs that surely my uprising will be there where are those devas that are formless, made from perceiving.
Concerning what has form, taking up the stick is to be seen, and taking up the sword, quarrel, dispute, contention, strife, slander, lying speech. But there is not this in what is formless throughout.’ So, by reflecting thus, he is one faring along precisely for the disregard of material shapes, for detachment (concerning them) and for their stopping.
Can and Cannot stop Becomings
There are, householders, some recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of this view: ‘There is not the stopping of becomings throughout.’ But, householders, there are some recluses and Brahmans who speak in direct opposition to those recluses and Brahmans and who say this: ‘There is the stopping of becomings throughout.’
What do you think about this, householders? Do not these recluses and Brahmans speak in direct opposition to one another? “Yes, revered sir.”
“Hereupon, householders, an intelligent man reflects thus: ‘Those worthy recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of this view: “There is not the stopping of becomings throughout”—this is not seen by me. But those worthy recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of this view: “There is the stopping of becomings throughout”—this is not known by me. And if I, not knowing, not seeing, were to take up one side and define it, saying: “This is the truth, all else is falsehood”—this would not be suitable in me.
If this is a true saying of those worthy recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of this view: “There is not the stopping of becomings throughout,” then this situation occurs that surely my uprising will be there where are those devas who are formless, made from perceiving. But if this is a true saying of those worthy recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of this view: “There is the stopping of becomings throughout,” then this situation occurs: that I will attain nibbāna here-now.
If this is a true saying of those worthy recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of this view: “There is not the stopping of becomings throughout,” this view of theirs is close to attachment, close to the fetters, close to delight, close to cleaving, close to grasping. But if this is a true saying of those worthy recluses and Brahmans who speak thus and are of this view: “There is the stopping of becomings throughout,” this view of theirs is close to detachment, close to the absence of the fetters, close to the absence of delight, close to the absence of cleaving, close to the absence of grasping.’ Through reflecting thus he is one faring along precisely for the disregard of becomings, for detachment (concerning them), and for their stopping.
Four Kinds of Persons
Householders, there are these four kinds of persons existing in the world. What four? Here, householders, some person is a tormentor of self, intent on the practice of self-torment. Here, householders, some person is a tormentor of others, intent on the practice of tormenting others. Here, householders, some person is both a self-tormentor, intent on the practice of tormenting self, and a tormentor of others, intent on the practice of tormenting others. Here, householders, some person is neither a self-tormentor intent on the practice of self-torment, nor a tormentor of others, intent on the practice of tormenting others. He, neither a self-tormentor nor a tormentor of others, is here-now allayed, quenched, become cool, an experiencer of bliss that lives with self Brahmā-become. [1] And which, householders, is the self-tormentor, intent on the practice of self-torment? In this case, householders, some person comes to be unclothed, flouting life's decencies, licking his hands (after meals)… (as in the Kandarakasutta)… Thus in many a way does he live intent on the practice of mortifying and tormenting his body. Householders, this person is called a self-tormentor, intent on the practice of self-torment. [2] And which, householders, is the tormentor of others, intent on the practice of tormenting others? In this case, householders, some person is a cattle-butcher, or pig-killer, fowler… or one of those others who follow a bloody calling. This is the person, householders, who is called a tormentor of others, intent on the practice of tormenting others. [3] And which, householders, is the person who is a self-tormentor, intent on the practice of self-torment, and also a tormentor of others, intent on the practice of tormenting others? In this case, householders, some person is a noble anointed king or a very rich Brahman… Those who are called his slaves or messengers or workpeople, they, scared of danger, with tearful faces and crying, set about their preparations. This, householders, is called the person who is a self-tormentor, intent on the practice of self-torment and also a tormentor of others, intent on the practice of tormenting others. [4] And which, householders, is the person who is neither a self-tormentor intent on the practice of self-torment, nor a tormentor of others intent on the practice of tormenting others, and who, neither a self-tormentor nor a tormentor of others, is here-now allayed, quenched, become cool, an experiencer of bliss that lives with self Brahmā-become? In this case, householders, a Tathagata arises in the world… Destroyed is birth, brought to a close the Brahmā-faring, done is what was to be done, there is no more of being such or so. This, householders, is called the person who is neither a self-tormentor, not intent on the practice of tormenting self, nor a tormentor of others, not intent on the practice of tormenting others, and who, neither a self-tormentor nor a tormentor of others, is here-now allayed, quenched, become cool, an experiencer of bliss that lives with self Brahmā-become.”
When this had been said, the Brahman householders of Sālā spoke thus to the Lord: “Excellent, good Gotama; good Gotama, it is excellent. It is as if, good Gotama, one might set upright what had been upset… even so in many a figure has Dhamma been made clear by the good Gotama. We are going to the revered Gotama for refuge and to Dhamma and to the Order of monks. May the good Gotama accept us as lay-disciples going for refuge from this day forth for as long as life lasts.”
Discourse on the Sure: The Tenth
- Translator: I.B. Horner
