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sn.42.6 Saṁyutta Nikāya (Linked Discourses)

To Asibandhakaputta

On one occasion the Blessed One was staying near Nalanda in the Pavarika Mango Grove. Then Asibandhakaputta the headman went to the Blessed One and on arrival, having bowed down to him, sat to one side. As he was sitting there he said to the Blessed One: “The brahmans of the Western lands, lord—those who carry water pots, wear garlands of water plants, purify with water, & worship fire—can take [the spirit of] a dead person, lift it out, instruct it, & send it to heaven. But the Blessed One, worthy & rightly self-awakened, can arrange it so that all the world, at the break-up of the body, after death, reappears in a good destination, the heavenly world.”

“Very well, then, headman, I will question you on this matter. Answer as you see fit. What do you think: There is the case where a man is one who takes life, steals, indulges in illicit sex; is a liar, one who speaks divisive speech, harsh speech, & idle chatter; is greedy, bears thoughts of ill-will, & holds to wrong views. Then a great crowd of people, gathering & congregating, would pray, praise, & circumambulate with their hands palm-to-palm over the heart [saying,] ‘May this man, at the break-up of the body, after death, reappear in a good destination, the heavenly world!’ What do you think: would that man—because of the prayers, praise, & circumambulation of that great crowd of people—at the break-up of the body, after death, reappear in a good destination, the heavenly world?”

“No, lord.”

“Suppose a man were to throw a large boulder into a deep lake of water, and a great crowd of people, gathering & congregating, would pray, praise, & circumambulate with their hands palm-to-palm over the heart [saying,] ‘Rise up, O boulder! Come floating up, O boulder! Come float to the shore, O boulder!’ What do you think: would that boulder—because of the prayers, praise, & circumambulation of that great crowd of people—rise up, come floating up, or come float to the shore?”

“No, lord.”

“So it is with any man who takes life, steals, indulges in illicit sex; is a liar, one who speaks divisive speech, harsh speech, & idle chatter; is greedy, bears thoughts of ill-will, & holds to wrong views. Even though a great crowd of people, gathering & congregating, would pray, praise, & circumambulate with their hands palm-to-palm over the heart—[saying,] ‘May this man, at the break-up of the body, after death, reappear in a good destination, the heavenly world!’—still, at the break-up of the body, after death, he would reappear in destitution, a bad destination, the lower realms, hell.

“Now what do you think: There is the case where a man is one who refrains from taking life, from stealing, & from indulging in illicit sex; he refrains from lying, from speaking divisive speech, from harsh speech, & from idle chatter; he is not greedy, bears no thoughts of ill-will, & holds to right view. Then a great crowd of people, gathering & congregating, would pray, praise, & circumambulate with their hands palm-to-palm over the heart [saying,] ‘May this man, at the break-up of the body, after death, reappear in destitution, a bad destination, the lower realms, hell!’ What do you think: would that man—because of the prayers, praise, & circumambulation of that great crowd of people—at the break-up of the body, after death, reappear in destitution, a bad destination, the lower realms, hell?”

“No, lord.”

“Suppose a man were to throw a jar of ghee or a jar of oil into a deep lake of water, where it would break. There the shards & jar-fragments would go down, while the ghee or oil would come up. Then a great crowd of people, gathering & congregating, would pray, praise, & circumambulate with their hands palm-to-palm over the heart [saying,] ‘Sink, O ghee/oil! Submerge, O ghee/oil! Go down, O ghee/oil!’ What do you think: would that ghee/oil, because of the prayers, praise, & circumambulation of that great crowd of people sink, submerge, or go down?”

“No, lord.”

“So it is with any man who refrains from taking life, from stealing, & from indulging in illicit sex; refrains from lying, from speaking divisive speech, from harsh speech, & from idle chatter; is not greedy, bears no thoughts of ill-will, & holds to right view. Even though a great crowd of people, gathering & congregating, would pray, praise, & circumambulate with their hands palm-to-palm over the heart—[saying,] ‘May this man, at the break-up of the body, after death, reappear in a destitution, a bad destination, the lower realms, hell!’—still, at the break-up of the body, after death, he would reappear in a good destination, the heavenly world.”

When this was said, Asibandhakaputta the headman said to the Blessed One: “Magnificent, lord! Magnificent! Just as if he were to place upright what was overturned, to reveal what was hidden, to point out the way to one who was lost, or to carry a lamp into the dark so that those with eyes could see forms, in the same way has the Blessed One—through many lines of reasoning—made the Dhamma clear. I go to the Blessed One for refuge, to the Dhamma, & to the community of monks. May the Blessed One remember me as a lay follower who has gone for refuge from this day forward, for life.”

- Translator: Thanissaro Bhikkhu

- Editor: Blake Walsh


With Asibandhaka’s Son

At one time the Buddha was staying near Nālandā in Pāvārika’s mango grove.
Then Asibandhaka’s son the chief went up to the Buddha, bowed, sat down to one side, and said to him:
“Sir, there are western brahmins draped with moss who carry pitchers, immerse themselves in water, and serve the sacred flame.
When someone has passed away, they truly lift them up, raise them up, and guide them along to heaven.
But what about the Blessed One, the perfected one, the fully awakened Buddha: is he able to ensure that the whole world will be reborn in a good place, a heavenly realm when their body breaks up, after death?”
“Well then, chief, I’ll ask you about this in return, and you can answer as you like.
What do you think, chief?
Take a person who kills living creatures, steals, and commits sexual misconduct. They use speech that’s false, divisive, harsh, or nonsensical. And they’re covetous, malicious, and have wrong view.
And a large crowd comes together to offer up prayers and praise, circumambulating them with joined palms and saying:
‘When this person’s body breaks up, after death, may they be reborn in a good place, a heavenly realm!’
What do you think, chief?
Would that person be reborn in heaven because of their prayers?”
“No, sir.”
“Chief, suppose a person were to throw a broad rock into a deep lake.
And a large crowd was to come together to offer up prayers and praise, circumambulating it with joined palms, and saying:
‘Rise, good rock! Float, good rock! Float to shore, good rock!’
What do you think, chief?
Would that broad rock rise up or float because of their prayers?”
“No, sir.”
“In the same way, take a person who kills living creatures, steals, and commits sexual misconduct. They use speech that’s false, divisive, harsh, or nonsensical. And they’re covetous, malicious, and have wrong view.
Even though a large crowd comes together to offer up prayers and praise …
when their body breaks up, after death, they’re reborn in a place of loss, a bad place, the underworld, hell.
What do you think, chief?
Take a person who doesn’t kill living creatures, steal, or commit sexual misconduct. They don’t use speech that’s false, divisive, harsh, or nonsensical. And they’re contented, kind-hearted, and have right view.
And a large crowd comes together to offer up prayers and praise, circumambulating them with joined palms and saying:
‘When this person’s body breaks up, after death, may they be reborn in a place of loss, a bad place, the underworld, hell!’
What do you think, chief?
Would that person be reborn in hell because of their prayers?”
“No, sir.”
“Chief, suppose a person were to sink a pot of ghee or oil into a deep lake and break it open. Its shards and chips would sink down, while the ghee or oil in it would rise up.
And a large crowd was to come together to offer up prayers and praise, circumambulating it with joined palms and saying:
‘Sink, good ghee or oil! Descend, good ghee or oil! Go down, good ghee or oil!”
What do you think, chief?
Would that ghee or oil sink and descend because of their prayers?”
“No, sir.”
“In the same way, take a person who doesn’t kill living creatures, steal, or commit sexual misconduct. They don’t use speech that’s false, divisive, harsh, or nonsensical. And they’re contented, kind-hearted, and have right view.
Even though a large crowd comes together to offer up prayers and praise …
when their body breaks up, after death, they’re reborn in a good place, a heavenly realm.”
When he said this, Asibandhaka’s son the chief said to the Buddha,
“Excellent, sir! …
From this day forth, may the Buddha remember me as a lay follower who has gone for refuge for life.”